Darby_ 10:23 Fri Feb 27
Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
|
85-86 under John Lyall:
45 points
This season under Allerdici:
39 points
05-06 Pardew's best season:
23 points
98-99 'Arry's best season:
20 points
08-08 Curbs/Zola:
18 points
|
|
|
Replies - Newest Posts First ( Show In Chronological Order)
Coffee
12:40 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
"It's more important to build a squad and then manage to improve it year on year"
Spot on.
|
Alex V
12:35 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Good points Nagel and Billy. The 'maddening inconsistency' you talk about might simply be the norm for any club in the position we've found ourselves over the years. If you win some and you lose some you're going to seem inconsistent. And it's a lot to do with the structure of the league - if we underachieve relegation will mean the bottom falls out and we have to effectively start from scratch, but if a top team underachieve they go into mid-table and can re-adjust without relegation.
I think as fans we put too much store by the manager in charge (encouraged by the media btw). As the stats tend to show, we've been capable of good or bad seasons with or without any of them. It's more important to build a squad and then manage to improve it year on year, and that's where West Ham have fallen down time and time again.
|
Billy Blagg
10:20 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Lies, damned lies and statistics. It doesn't matter if Darby's stats are bollocks as they mean nothing. A club with the stature of West Ham will struggle to get 6 points from either Chelsea or Manchester City and the more clubs there are with a bigger financial backing will determine how many points we get and where we finish.
Just to make a point you understand - but if Real Madrid and Barcelona joined the PL - what number of points could be correspondingly expect to get? Wouldn't a top ten finish then be a good placing?
When Lyall was boss they talked about breaking the 'Big Five' now it's the Seven (City and Chelsea have broken through since then). That makes eighth place a relatively good finish. It has little to do with who is in charge and it's one of the reason why - despite his faults - I am broadly a supporter of Allardyce.
There is an argument that runs parallel to this which is 'Are WHU where they should be given their history?' - could / should they have down what Chelsea did for instance (something Alex V touches on when he says we're roughly in the same place where we were when Redknapp was in charge) - but that's a whole other debate.
As far as the stats are concerned it doesn't matter what they say. Nagel's post below just shows what West Ham are really about - maddening inconsistency - and that's not changed since Malcolm Allison was on the ground staff!
|
Nagel
9:53 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Fair play to Darby for owning up to a massive fuckup, but if the stats were actually the way he needed them to be to prove his point then it would still have been an awful thread.
Here's some other stats taken from part of the season:
Roeder was one of our best ever managers as in the season we got relegated, in his last 11 games we got 18 points. Extrapolate that over 38 games and we'd have finished with 62 points - our highest ever total in the PL.
Or:
Curbishley was one of our worst ever managers as soon after he took over he led us to 2 points in 10 PL games, our worst ever run of form over that length of time.
You can do this sort of thing for every manager and it's all pretty meaningless.
|
Private Dancer
7:24 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Darby is a known BFS apologist, but this is a disgrace.
|
Coffee
7:20 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
The honourable Darby_.
Well done!
|
Darby_
7:18 Sat Feb 28
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Thanks, Nicey.
And thanks everyone for the cunting off. It's better than I deserve.
|
Nicey
11:23 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Well done Darby SON
That is BFS standard manipulation of made up stats. Bravo!
|
franksfat&slow&wank
11:05 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Hot piss
|
Brucies_Star_Prize
10:18 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
ajc123 9:39 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
No, are you one of those people that thinks that 'success' is avoiding relegation every year.
No - and I'm not sure why you ask that.
My measure of success is relative to the state a club is in and the resources available to it.
Will Sean Dyche be a success if he keeps Burnley up by the skin of their teeth? Unequivocally.
Will Manuel Pelligrini be a success in making the last 16 of the Champions League and coming 2nd in the Prem. I'd say not.
For Allardyce's faults, I prefer to look at the bottom line. That's rock bottom relegation to 8th in the Prem with the strongest squad we've had in a long time. For his part in that I view him as a success.
As for 'better times in the future' I really hope so, but it's unlikely we'll get there without some serious investment in the playing squad. We could hire the best manager in the world but taking us to the next level (and keeping us there) is about far more than that.
|
ajc123
9:39 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
No, are you one of those people that thinks that 'success' is avoiding relegation every year.
The point is we have a manager who's supporters claim he's a success because he does that and are happy for him to shit on our past because his 'success' is better. It ain't, he ain't and as a club we've had better times in the past and will in the future.
But for the record, the FA Cup final was fantastic. Allardyce is nowhere near that, and that was with less of a squad than we have now.
|
Brucies_Star_Prize
7:12 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
ajc123 6:06 Fri Feb 27
You're holding up Pardews 2004/05 Championship season up as a shining example of the West Ham way?
|
White Pony
6:45 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Woof crow is right.
|
whufcroe
6:39 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
All I'm saying that isn't a great haul for 120 years worth of football to be honest is it?
|
ajc123
6:33 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
croe except they're not made up, and I only c+p'd them!
Sometimes it needs pointing out to the Lard Arse Luvvees that we had a club before he was here, and we'll have one after. Once a few years are put between him and us he will just be a rather boring insignificant stat tucked away in over a 100 years of history.
|
kylay
6:24 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
"I also like his latest pitiful excuse for not being able to develop young players - it's too difficult especially as they don't fit in with his system."
That's the mark of a bad coach right there. you go to battle with the army you have, not the one you wish you had.
|
whufcroe
6:24 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
ajc123 6:06 Fri Feb 27
Lets be honest, those stats don't make great reading do they.
Almost as stupid as the opening post
|
ajc123
6:06 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
I prefer these verified stats:
The West Ham Way -
Football League best position: 3rd 1985-86 First Division
Second Division Champions: 1957-58, 1980-81
Championship Play-off Winners: 2004-05
FA Cup Winners 1963-64, 1974-75, 1979-80
FA Cup Finalists 1922-23, 2005-06
European Cup Winners Cup Winners: 1964-65
European Cup Winners Cup Finalists: 1975-76
League Cup Finalists: 1965-66, 1980-81
Intertoto Cup Winners: 1998-99
Football League War Cup Winners: 1940
FA Premier Academy U19 Champions: 1998-99, 1999-2000
FA Youth Cup Winners: 1963, 1981, 1999
South-East Counties Champions: 1984-85, 1995-96, 1997-98
The Allardici Way
Championship Play-off Winners: 2000-01, 2011-12
League Cup Finalist: 2003-4
and nothing else.
I also like his latest pitiful excuse for not being able to develop young players - it's too difficult especially as they don't fit in with his system.
Compare that to Greenwood and Lyall who took players and got the best out of them even if it meant converting to a new position. And even as impact players (Ade Coker is one fondly remembered). Allardici is just lost at sea, in a sea of difficulty and modern complexity
|
Alex V
5:47 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Yep - 51 points after 26 in 85/86.
|
The Joker
5:46 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Classic WHO, this.
|
Tony_Gale
5:29 Fri Feb 27
Re: Points after 26 games - compared to other seasons
|
Haha, even the 85/86 points totals are wrong.
Do you work in Allardichi's statistical department by any chance? Do you tell him we have a 90% win ratio with NOLAN in the team?
|
| 
